 |
| Author |
Message |
bg_turk
Deputy
Joined: 08 Oct 2005
Posts: 1317
Location: Bulgaria
|
|
| Kifeas wrote: |
| brother wrote: |
There are many incidents like this from both sides, only recently a Greek Cypriot soilder shot a turkish soilder at the border for no reason.
|
Can you give us some more information on this incident? |
I believe he refers to this incident:
http://www.cnn.com/WORLD/9609/08/cyprus/ |
|
| Back to top |
|
Mete
Warnings : 3
Deputy
Joined: 16 Aug 2005
Posts: 1150
Location: Boston
|
|
No he doesn't refer to the incident you mentioned. This happenned only a few months ago. A Greek Cypriot soldier shot a Turkish soldier on the Green line. The Turkish soldier was not killed but he was injured. I don't know any links to the news sources but it was something that we talked about in this or the other forum. |
|
| Back to top |
|
Kifeas
Warnings : 6
Ministerial
Joined: 26 Aug 2005
Posts: 2733
Location: Location: Pafos-Cyprus, since 1974 ethnic cleansing. Originally, Lapithos, northern occupied Cyprus.
|
|
| bg_turk wrote: |
| Kifeas wrote: |
| brother wrote: |
There are many incidents like this from both sides, only recently a Greek Cypriot soilder shot a turkish soilder at the border for no reason.
|
Can you give us some more information on this incident? |
I believe he refers to this incident:
http://www.cnn.com/WORLD/9609/08/cyprus/ |
You are referring to the killing of a Turkish soldier of Kurdish origin in September 1996 in a guard post near Achna village, adjacent to the British bases in Famagusta region.
I suggest you also read the reports that the UN (UNFICYP) did and the SBA (British bases police) did on the incident, and not just what the CNN reported on the basis of what the Turkish Cypriot newspapers wrote.
It has never been proved, nor any evidence to suggest that this soldier was murdered by Greek Cypriots. To the contrary, sources from the soldier's family who happen to be in Cyprus, claimed that they suspect the soldier was killed from within the Turkish Army as he had some conflicts. This incident occurred shortly after the murders of Solomou and Isaak in Deryneia and what was the dominating opinion then was that those that killed the Turkish soldier had chosen to close their whatever accounts with the person while he was on guard duty so that they blame it on the Greek Cypriots, simultaneously easing the tension among the Greek Cypriots and the fear that they would have attempted to take arbitrary and indiscrete revenge for the Isaak and Solomou murders. |
|
| Back to top |
|
respiridus
Deputy
Joined: 26 Oct 2005
Posts: 1966
Location: Pera Orinis, Nicosia, Cyprus
|
|
OK, why not try to put this into the right perspective. Let's see who killed who the last 31 years.
Greek Cypriots killed by Turkish Cypriots or Turks:
- 8 Greek Cypriot soldiers killed before 1996. I don't have their names handy right now, but I'll try and find them.
- Tassos Isaak (1996)
- Solomos Solomou (1996)
- Petros Kakoulli (1996)
- Anyone else???
Turkish Cypriots killed by Greek Cypriots or Greeks:
- Unnamed Turkish Cypriot soldier (1996). The incident is disputed (may have not been killed by Greek Cypriots).
- Anyone else???
Please note that I'm not trying to start an argument here, but rather to attempt to find the truth. Therefore, I would like to ask Turkish Cypriots in this forum to report any other murders of Turkish Cypriots that took place during the last 31 years. That way, we can have a complete list  |
|
| Back to top |
|
Dhavlos
Warnings : 1
Site Admin
Joined: 13 Aug 2005
Posts: 4697
Location: Birmingham
|
|
| you could add the number of people, british soldiers have killed too in cyprus, when the go out of the bases! |
|
| Back to top |
|
Crash Test Dummy
Warnings : 3
Ministerial
Joined: 25 Sep 2005
Posts: 4941
Location: London(ish)
|
|
| I am by no way saying that takign the flag down was a good idea however all they had to do was pull him down or shoot him in the leg, not empty 5 shots into his chest. |
|
| Back to top |
|
Birkibrisli
Deputy
Joined: 29 Aug 2005
Posts: 1466
Location: Australia
|
|
| brother wrote: |
| Birkibrisli wrote: |
| Unless this and other cold blooded murders are brought to justice,and people accountable punished with the full force of the law,we have little hope of establishing trust between the two communities.No wonder the Turkish Republic of Northern Cyprus is called a lawless state.There is no excuse for such acts of barbarity. |
There are many incidents like this from both sides, only recently a Greek Cypriot soilder shot a turkish soilder at the border for no reason.
In 1986 there was a uproar when Greek Cypriot soilders were taped at the border taunting Turkish Cypriot soilders about how they raped and killed Turkish Cypriot in 1974 and how they were going to do it again blah blah blah and then one of the Greek Cypriot soilders took his penis out and said this is what we are going to rape your mothers, daughters, sisters, wives etc. with . This was all taped and documented by UN forces after Turkish Cypriot complained about how frequently and revolting they were doing it.
What did the Greek Cypriot goverment do......nothing......if the Turkish Republic of Northern Cyprus is lawless then the Republic of Cyprus is a complete cowboy state and even more lawless.
Birkibrisli i don't know why you are so eager to knock the Turkish Republic of Northern Cyprus or its leaders etc. but both sides are as bad as each other and from your many posts i can see that you fail many times to be objective and always look to blame the Turkish Republic of Northern Cyprus and join the Greek Cypriot general parade of name calling. |
Dear brother,
I always try not to call anyone any names,but if I failed at some stage I apologise unreservedly.It is not my style.
If you mean i called the Turkish Republic of Northern Cyprus "lawless",I make no apologies for that,because that is how it seems to me. If other people think so as well,that is not something I am concerned with.
Your logic that we should not criticise our own because the "other" side is as bad or worse is deeply flawed.Two wrongs do not make a right,that is something I am sure you will agree with.If I am being harder on the Turkish Republic of Northern Cyprus side,it is because I know more about them than the Republic of Cyprus.I simply don't know what is going on in the South,and I do not trust the Turkish Cypriot media to be objective about what happens in the Republic of Cyprus.So i refrain from jumping on any bandwagons.But when the Turkish Cypriot media reports something negative about the Turkish Republic of Northern Cyprus I take it for granted that it is true.Otherwise they woundn't be publishing it,if they know what it good for them.
Also I think it is more credible if we critcise our own side.And there are plenty of Greek Cypriots in this forum who are capable of that.I leave it up to them.
My strong belief is that if we are to increase the trust and understanding between our communities with the aim of solving our problems and reun ifying our country,we must not sweep anything under the carpet but bring it out in the open so we can discuss it.How else will we right the wrongs in Cyprus if we do not speak out when we see them?I don't say anything lightly or without due consideration in this or any other forum.But I will be damned if I see something wrong with the Turkish Republic of Northern Cyprus and not say it.If more people on both sides did what I am doing,we might soon get to the point where a solution can be feasible.If we keep saying we might be wrong but your wrongs are even bigger,we will get nowhere.Or rather we will get exactly where we are now and no further.  |
|
| Back to top |
|
brother
Warnings : 3
Site Admin
Joined: 15 Aug 2005
Posts: 8938
Location: London/Cyprus
|
|
| Birkibrisli wrote: |
| brother wrote: |
| Birkibrisli wrote: |
| Unless this and other cold blooded murders are brought to justice,and people accountable punished with the full force of the law,we have little hope of establishing trust between the two communities.No wonder the Turkish Republic of Northern Cyprus is called a lawless state.There is no excuse for such acts of barbarity. |
There are many incidents like this from both sides, only recently a Greek Cypriot soilder shot a turkish soilder at the border for no reason.
In 1986 there was a uproar when Greek Cypriot soilders were taped at the border taunting Turkish Cypriot soilders about how they raped and killed Turkish Cypriot in 1974 and how they were going to do it again blah blah blah and then one of the Greek Cypriot soilders took his penis out and said this is what we are going to rape your mothers, daughters, sisters, wives etc. with . This was all taped and documented by UN forces after Turkish Cypriot complained about how frequently and revolting they were doing it.
What did the Greek Cypriot goverment do......nothing......if the Turkish Republic of Northern Cyprus is lawless then the Republic of Cyprus is a complete cowboy state and even more lawless.
Birkibrisli i don't know why you are so eager to knock the Turkish Republic of Northern Cyprus or its leaders etc. but both sides are as bad as each other and from your many posts i can see that you fail many times to be objective and always look to blame the Turkish Republic of Northern Cyprus and join the Greek Cypriot general parade of name calling. |
Dear brother,
I always try not to call anyone any names,but if I failed at some stage I apologise unreservedly.It is not my style.
If you mean i called the Turkish Republic of Northern Cyprus "lawless",I make no apologies for that,because that is how it seems to me. If other people think so as well,that is not something I am concerned with.
Your logic that we should not criticise our own because the "other" side is as bad or worse is deeply flawed.Two wrongs do not make a right,that is something I am sure you will agree with.If I am being harder on the Turkish Republic of Northern Cyprus side,it is because I know more about them than the Republic of Cyprus.I simply don't know what is going on in the South,and I do not trust the Turkish Cypriot media to be objective about what happens in the Republic of Cyprus.So i refrain from jumping on any bandwagons.But when the Turkish Cypriot media reports something negative about the Turkish Republic of Northern Cyprus I take it for granted that it is true.Otherwise they woundn't be publishing it,if they know what it good for them.
Also I think it is more credible if we critcise our own side.And there are plenty of Greek Cypriots in this forum who are capable of that.I leave it up to them.
My strong belief is that if we are to increase the trust and understanding between our communities with the aim of solving our problems and reun ifying our country,we must not sweep anything under the carpet but bring it out in the open so we can discuss it.How else will we right the wrongs in Cyprus if we do not speak out when we see them?I don't say anything lightly or without due consideration in this or any other forum.But I will be damned if I see something wrong with the Turkish Republic of Northern Cyprus and not say it.If more people on both sides did what I am doing,we might soon get to the point where a solution can be feasible.If we keep saying we might be wrong but your wrongs are even bigger,we will get nowhere.Or rather we will get exactly where we are now and no further. |
I understand where you are coming from but my point is and always was that you should critisize all sides when you see a wrong not just the side you see as your own. |
|
| Back to top |
|
respiridus
Deputy
Joined: 26 Oct 2005
Posts: 1966
Location: Pera Orinis, Nicosia, Cyprus
|
|
| Dhavlos wrote: |
| you could add the number of people, british soldiers have killed too in cyprus, when the go out of the bases! |
Re, can you be a little more specific? I don't know anything about such incidents. The only thing I remember was something about a soldier who got into a fight a few years ago in Limassol. |
|
| Back to top |
|
Dhavlos
Warnings : 1
Site Admin
Joined: 13 Aug 2005
Posts: 4697
Location: Birmingham
|
|
Didnt british soldiers rape and kill a dutch girl near larnaca a few years back?
Havent their been quite a few incidents of British Forces, when they go out and get drunk, of attacking locals? Maybe not recently, but im sure they have done things too, but maybe not killing, just maiming? |
|
| Back to top |
|
respiridus
Deputy
Joined: 26 Oct 2005
Posts: 1966
Location: Pera Orinis, Nicosia, Cyprus
|
|
| Dhavlos wrote: |
Didnt british soldiers rape and kill a dutch girl near larnaca a few years back?
Havent their been quite a few incidents of British Forces, when they go out and get drunk, of attacking locals? Maybe not recently, but im sure they have done things too, but maybe not killing, just maiming? |
The reason for that is the general stupidity of drunken Englishmen, not the politics of the UK, re. |
|
| Back to top |
|
Dhavlos
Warnings : 1
Site Admin
Joined: 13 Aug 2005
Posts: 4697
Location: Birmingham
|
|
| Oh, dont get me wrong, i wasnt saying that it was the policy of the UK to 'kill' people in cyprus.... butim just stating that British Troops have also killed peole in cyprus. |
|
| Back to top |
|
cannedmoose
Warnings : 4
Moderator
Joined: 12 Aug 2005
Posts: 5358
Location: National Forest, England
|
|
| Dhavlos wrote: |
| Oh, dont get me wrong, i wasnt saying that it was the policy of the UK to 'kill' people in cyprus.... butim just stating that British Troops have also killed peole in cyprus. |
Not whilst in uniform... the attacks on a small number of tourists (personally I only know of this one incident) were not 'killings' ordered by the UK military, they were murders committed by rogue soldiers off-duty and off-base. The UK cannot be held accountable for these, these could easily have been UK tourists getting drunk and attacking people. |
|
| Back to top |
|
repulsewarrior
Ministerial
Joined: 06 Jan 2006
Posts: 2152
Location: a cypriot in canada
|
|
| Quote: |
ECHR: murdered soldier posed no threat
By Stefanos Evripidou
THE EUROPEAN Court of Human Rights yesterday charged Turkey with violating the right to life in two separate cases brought by Greek Cypriots against Turkey.
In the first case, concerning the application of Kallis and Androulla Panayi against Turkey, the Court ruled there was a violation of Article 2 of the European Convention on Human rights and awarded €35,000 to each in respect of non-pecuniary damages and €9,888.30 for costs and expenses.
The two took Turkey to Strasburg after their 19-year-old son serving in the National Guard, Stelios Panayi, was killed in June 1996 by Turkish occupation forces after entering the UN buffer zone while off duty and unarmed. Panayi had crossed the buffer zone to swap hats with a Turkish Cypriot soldier. When members of the UN Peace Keeping Force in Cyprus (UNFICYP) attempted to reach him to save his life, the Turkish armed forces fired shots, preventing him from receiving medical treatment, resulting in his death.
The Turkish government disputed the facts presented by the applicants, claiming that Panayi was “fully armed, making gestures by hand and calling the Turkish Cypriot soldiers to go over to him”.'
Disputing Turkey’s allegations that Panayi was armed, the Court ruled that “although Stelios had been wearing uniform and hence one could have assumed that he might have carried a gun, that fact alone could not in the circumstances have justified the shots fired at him”.
“The Turkish soldiers had been in complete control of the area and Stelios’ behaviour had not posed a threat to them; consequently the soldiers would have been able to stop him without jeopardising his life,” said the ruling.
The Court found unanimously that Stelios Panayi had been killed by representatives of the Turkish authorities who had used excessive force, not justified by the circumstances of the case, in violation of Article 2.
The second case concerns Georgia Andreou, now deceased, a British national who was shot by Turkish soldiers on August 14, 1996, during the killing of Solomos Solomou who was shot five times while trying to climb up a Turkish flag-pole. Solomou was attending the demonstration following the funeral of Tassos Isaak who had been kicked and beaten to death by Turkish Cypriot policemen and demonstrators three days earlier at a motorcycle rally.
Although standing outside the buffer zone, Andreou sustained a serious gunshot wound to her abdomen when Turkish and Turkish Cypriot forces opened fire on Solomou and the crowd.
According to two high-ranking UNFICYP members, uniformed Turkish or Turkish-Cypriot military personnel were seen kneeling down and firing in the direction of the demonstrators inside the UN buffer zone.
As a result, two British UNFICYP soldiers and two Greek Cypriot civilians (one of whom was the applicant) were hit by gunfire. According to the ECHR, this version of events was also confirmed in a report by the UN Secretary-General.
“The indiscriminate and unwarranted firing into the crowd which was gathering inside and outside the buffer zone had put numerous lives at risk. The fact that the applicant had not been killed was fortuitous,” said the Court.
The Court considered that, irrespective of whether or not the soldiers had actually intended to kill Andreou, she had been the victim of conduct which by its very nature had put her life at risk, even though, in the event, she had actually survived. Turkey was once again found guilty of violating Article 2, the right to life.
Anreou’s husband and children were subsequently awarded €585.68 in pecuniary damages, €40,000 in non-pecuniary damages and €10,000 in costs and expenses.
Copyright © Cyprus Mail 2009 |
|
|
| Back to top |
|
100%cypriot
Warnings : 4
Ministerial
Joined: 27 Jun 2006
Posts: 2181
|
|
| one wonders if the perpetrators of the murder of a doctor's wife and 3 children hiding in a bath in lefkosa will also be found and punished ?????????? |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
All times are GMT + 3 Hours
Goto page Previous 1, 2
|
| Page 2 of 2 |
| |
 
 
Link Partners
605057 Attacks blocked
|
Register 
Log in 
Album 
Home