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[Mete]

mikkie2 wrote:
For example, Pertev and Tzionis were pretty much close to agreeing the start of the July 8th process. Pertev is then summoned to Ankara and lo and behold, he comes back and torpedoes the process!

Can you give me more information on this? What did Pertev and Tzionis initially agree on? And how did Pertev torpedo the process? Curious to know what information you have.

[cypezokyli]

Mete wrote: mikkie2 wrote:
For example, Pertev and Tzionis were pretty much close to agreeing the start of the July 8th process. Pertev is then summoned to Ankara and lo and behold, he comes back and torpedoes the process!

Can you give me more information on this? What did Pertev and Tzionis initially agree on? And how did Pertev torpedo the process? Curious to know what information you have.

this is a rough translation from a journalist of the newspaper "politis"
Quote: the kids are playing

they are both leaders. they are both presidents. one is recognized the other not. both claim that the purpose of their life is the solution. they commit to it every time to make everything they can. but since july 2006 they didnt manage to sit on the same table. they did not manage to talk like two human beings. they talk to each other through microphones. through public statements, filed with poison or absolute irony. lately foreigners pushed them both in the corner. to tassos they said that if he doesnt make a move on the cyppro he will partition the island with his signature. through direct trade. to talat they said , that if he ever wants to become a recognized power he has to sit on the negotiating table. our leaders were under pressure. and they send their representatives to strike a deal. to decide the begining of the bicomunal talks. like always it was done not out of their own will. if they want to be honest they dont really feel comfortable with agreeing. there is no chemistry between them. it was obvious yesterday. the representatives (tjionis an pertev) were close. after months of preparation they were ready to begin talking. but pertev blew it. obviously he was instructed to do so. the turkish side could not discuss the property subject. despite the constructive , despite strictly procedural formula, that was proposed by the Greek Cypriots. they got stuck. and what did the leaders do? what they always do. tried to blame it on each other. tassos publicly invited talat for dialogue. he spoke of "mutual understanding" and "positive developments". despite the fact that he knew that the Turkish Cypriot leader said no. talat did ofcource the same - accused. he claimed that tpap had cunning intentions. he threatened to abandon the negotiation. a grandiose mess. while both are claiming that they want to find a solution.
and we ask : if thats their intention , is it necessary to talk to each other through public statements ? is it so difficult to pick the phone and meet secretly? in the presence of mr Moller. to see if they really cannot communicate? without commitments. they chose the microphones. they remember the campari plan. so many years in politics and two cypriots wait for people who have no clue, to find for them a way to start negotiating. and they insist to strictly follow those procedures. they dont have a vision , a bit of their own imagination. they dont want to have.


i think he got the point

Quote:
Obviously Soyer and Talat didn't have the guts to say that they were 1st and foremost CYPRIOT.
talat is seriously constrained on what he can do and say. he is attacked from us, the Turkish Cypriot right-wing, and the army. if he tries to make a move towards us, they other two will grab him from the neck. and if they do,we will sit back looking and enjoying. if he tries to satisfy those two - we will accuse him (perhaps levent as well). not to mention that if he makes a small positive step , he will get no reaction from our side - in essence proving the Turkish Cypriot extremists right.
did i expect more from talat ? yes i did. but i dont think that his position is so easy. i have also to agree with lewis on this :
Quote:
Tpap is not clever enough to exploit any dfferences between the Tukish military and Turkish Cypriots, he is unable or unwilling tell them apart.

[100%cypriot]

I am Afraid the General has made a grave error if he said that in public

[-mikkie2-]

Mete,

Unfortunately, the Turkish press won't usually state the facts of what goes on, rather they twist stories to put the blame squarely on the Greek Cypriot's because in their eye we are evil, nasty people that want to dominate the world, the universe and everything.

You will never get an objective opinion via the Turkish press. That has been my experience. Article 301 looms large on them I am afraid!

Pertev was supposed to give a positive reply to start the July 8th process on Monday. The UN and other diplomatic circles were actually being positive that something good was about to happen. Prior to Monday, Pertev was summoned to Ankara and on his return he laid down new demands which effectively torpedoed the process!

Now the question is WHY do Turkish Cypriot representatives need to report to Ankara before making any decisions? It is obvious that the Turkish Cypriot's have ZERO power to negotiate or do anything Cyprus. Why does Pertev need to be summned to Ankara? Isn't he supposed to be Talats representative? Complete joke I'm afraid to say.

[Mete]

mikkie2 wrote:
Unfortunately, the Turkish press won't usually state the facts of what goes on, rather they twist stories to put the blame squarely on the Greek Cypriot's because in their eye we are evil, nasty people that want to dominate the world, the universe and everything.

My observation from outside Cyprus is that the Greek Cypriot press is not any better but anyway, let's agree with what you said. That's why I had asked you about more information, to see if there was more information that wasn't present in the Turkish Cypriot media.
mikkie2 wrote:
Pertev was supposed to give a positive reply to start the July 8th process on Monday. The UN and other diplomatic circles were actually being positive that something good was about to happen. Prior to Monday, Pertev was summoned to Ankara and on his return he laid down new demands which effectively torpedoed the process!

Ok, that's what you said earlier. I was asking for more specifics. Like what new demands Pertev asked?

[cypezokyli]

is it true that a proffesor (named zekki besihtebeli ) who teached at the mediteranean university in famagusta was lost his job bc he expressed critisism against the turkish army ?

[moonskin]

cypezokyli wrote: is it true that a proffesor (named zekki besihtebeli ) who teached at the mediteranean university in famagusta was lost his job bc he expressed critisism against the turkish army ?

His name is Zeki Besiktepeli (very close cypez :) ) and he is a lecturer of law at the Near East University in Nicosia, not in East Mediterranean Uni in Famagusta. He does defend things very extreme to the notions which are in place in the North. However, I have not heard anything about him being sacked. Is this new info you read/heard somewhere? If so where, could you please share this info with us?

Unfortunately, our history with sacking people who say "naughty" things is not so nice. Umit Inatci was a lecturer at the NEU as well and he was sacked. Another example was that of Nilgun Orhon, a secondary school teacher, was also suspended from her job in Nicosia.

[cypezokyli]

hi moonskin
it was written today in phileleftheros newspaper (they were the ones that mixed the unis as well :wink: )

accorcing to the article , the professor gave an interview in astra radio station (akels radio station) , where he said that he was fired! the reason had to do with the fight between soyer and the general. zekki supported that CTP is not obliged to play the turkish national anthem in its meetings.

heres the link :

http://www.phileleftheros.com/main/main.asp?gid=140&id=475986

more .... :dunno:
thats why i am asking...

[brother]

The unrest keeps growing and with it the fustration of the Turkish Cypriot people.

[cypezokyli]

brother wrote: The unrest keeps growing and with it the fustration of the Turkish Cypriot people.

i am not sure how frustration is described.

yesterday, according to politis newspaper 104 Turkish Cypriot "mayors" ( muhtars ? dont really know how to call them) have visited the turkish general and expressed their support to the him!!!

can anyone verify the above ?

anyway, if it does indeed hold....dont really know how many muhtars there are in the north, but that seems as a really big number of elected (or appointed?) individuals

[Birkibrisli]

cypezokyli wrote: brother wrote: The unrest keeps growing and with it the fustration of the Turkish Cypriot people.

i am not sure how frustration is described.

yesterday, according to politis newspaper 104 Turkish Cypriot "mayors" ( muhtars ? dont really know how to call them) have visited the turkish general and expressed their support to the him!!!

can anyone verify the above ?

anyway, if it does indeed hold....dont really know how many muhtars there are in the north, but that seems as a really big number of elected (or appointed?) individuals

It is truly bizzare that the general is getting more support from the Turkish Cypriots than Soyer...But I suspect they are the UBP and DP supporters who have taken this opportunity to kiss some Turkish arse...

It seems to be true,Cypez... :(

[Birkibrisli]

Mikkie...I think you are being unfair to Talat and Soyer when you say they have NO power. It is indeed true that singly they can do nothing, but together they can decide that nothing can be done.... :twisted: