www.talkcyprus.org

brother · Joined: 15 Aug 2005 Posts: 8920 Location: London/Cyprus

This is a poll to find out what our members think, i believe the reason negotiations have not begun to date is because tassos is taking a hard line approach to suit his agenda, whatever they may be.

All comments are welcome and appreciated.

Dhavlos · Joined: 13 Aug 2005 Posts: 4697 Location: Birmingham

i wouldnt know what to say about it as im not sure of the ins and outs of whos stopping who in negotiations etc...

To be honest, i think the Greek Cypriots see him as a person with boundries that he will not coss whatsoever, but Turkish Cypriots see him as a blocking to negotiations.

brother · Joined: 15 Aug 2005 Posts: 8920 Location: London/Cyprus

Dhavlos wrote: i wouldnt know what to say about it as im not sure of the ins and outs of whos stopping who in negotiations etc...

To be honest, i think the Greek Cypriots see him as a person with boundries that he will not coss whatsoever, but Turkish Cypriots see him as a blocking to negotiations.

You should investigate and learn what the problem so you can have an informed opinion as this effects us all and i would like for it not to be carried over to our children.

Dhavlos · Joined: 13 Aug 2005 Posts: 4697 Location: Birmingham

i know this sounds stupid, but where could i find relevent info?

the newspapers? just so you know, i would need to read english language stuff cos my greek is really bad!

Ixtanbul · Joined: 23 Aug 2005 Posts: 32 Location: Turkey

I voted "yes" cause Papadopoulos is a huge obstacle in front of negotiation talks and peace on the island. Not only did he cry on national TV on the night before the referendum for the Annan plan but he also is a former EOKA terrorist, how do Greek Cypriots expect Turkish Cypriots to feel??? There leader is a man who devoted his life to wipe out all the Turkish Cypriots and actually took place in the movement some 35 years ago...

brother · Joined: 15 Aug 2005 Posts: 8920 Location: London/Cyprus

Try the archives of the Cyprus mail and the Cyprus weekly for Greek Cypriot news and 'Turkish daily news' and 'zaman' for Turkish Cypriot news, all are in english and will give you the two sides of the story, i daily read all cypriot news and also greek and turkish papers, helps me push out a lot of bias.

Dhavlos · Joined: 13 Aug 2005 Posts: 4697 Location: Birmingham

thanks bro

Alexandros Lordos · Joined: 19 Aug 2005 Posts: 324 Location: Cyprus/Greece

brother wrote: This is a poll to find out what our members think, i believe the reason negotiations have not begun to date is because tassos is taking a hard line approach to suit his agenda, whatever they may be.

All comments are welcome and appreciated.

Brother, I think that Tassos might be a convenient scapegoat, but in fact it is not just him but nearly all sides involved that are blocking the recommencement of negotiations.

- The Turkish Cypriot leadership doesn't want negotiations because they fear the concessions they might be asked to make, and they also fear losing the "good side" image which they gained after the referendum.

- Turkey doesn't want negotiations because they know that all efforts would focus on the security aspect, which for the Turkish Army is non-negotiable.

- The UK and the US do not want negotiations because they don't want Turkey to be embarassed within the EU by appearing to take an intransigent - hardline position. Instead, the UK and the US are focusing on "Ending Turkish Cypriot isolation" because they hope that this will force the hand of the Greek Cypriots and make them accept Turkish terms for a settlement.

- The UN does not want negotiations, because they currently see a large gap in the positions of the two sides and do not want to bear the embarassment of yet another failure.

As for the Greek Cypriot side and Tassos, the situation is:

- Negotiations would be welcomed if they have an open character that will allow thorough discussion of Security, Property and Settlers.

- Negotiations would not be welcome if they will be based on the philosophy of "mimimal adjustments to the Annan Plan".

Since the Turkish Cypriots, Turkey, the UK and the US adopt the second approach, it is understandable that common terms for recommencing negotiations cannot yet be found ...

Viewpoint · Joined: 14 Aug 2005 Posts: 971 Location: Lefkosa/Nicosia

I voted YES because Papadop for Turkish Cypriots is just a big negative ex EOKA man who contributed to the Akritas plan and hates anything Turkish which includes us. A man trapped in the 50/60s trying to head an Greek Cypriot administration in 2005 with the ideals of those dark years is unlikely to want any union with Turkish Cypriots, don't forget he was also against the 1960 agreements. He has proven he can lie to suit his aims eg no Turkish Cypriots died between 1963-1968 and that he said he had given the UN the green light on restarting negotiations the UN said he did nothing of the sort, the mans a liar he manipulates the Greek Cypriot public opinion by emotional nationalist speeches and can cry at the drop of a hat.
The sheer arrogance of the man not accepting to meet with Talat, no solution will arrive until he vacates his office.
His politics are so obvious he is playing for his next term in office and the EU leverage game hoping he can obtain maximum demands without any compromise via the EU against Turkey.

brother · Joined: 15 Aug 2005 Posts: 8920 Location: London/Cyprus

What you say makes sense alex but tassos is not approaching Talat and if anything is completely ignoring all his calls for negotiations or even a informal coffee which to many seems like tassos is the stumbling block, i ask you what would tassos have to lose by meeting with talat apart from show the world and the Turkish Cypriot he is ready to negotiate.

-mikkie2- · Joined: 29 Aug 2005 Posts: 603

Quote: ignoring all his calls for negotiations

Really? Is Talat begging Tassos to negotiate? Talat wants us to say 'yes' to A5 with miniscule, cosmetic changes. That is not negotiating!

brother · Joined: 15 Aug 2005 Posts: 8920 Location: London/Cyprus

Quote: Really? Is Talat begging Tassos to negotiate? Talat wants us to say 'yes' to A5 with miniscule, cosmetic changes. That is not negotiating!

You could only say that id tassos had met with talat and these demands were made until them tassos is stopping negotiations imo.

Viewpoint · Joined: 14 Aug 2005 Posts: 971 Location: Lefkosa/Nicosia

-mikkie2- wrote: Quote: ignoring all his calls for negotiations

Really? Is Talat begging Tassos to negotiate? Talat wants us to say 'yes' to A5 with miniscule, cosmetic changes. That is not negotiating!

He even refused a social meeting arranged by Christofyas and that was with no agenda just to break the ice.
The man is just a dead end he will lead Greek Cypriots on a road to nowhere.

Alexandros Lordos · Joined: 19 Aug 2005 Posts: 324 Location: Cyprus/Greece

brother wrote: What you say makes sense alex but tassos is not approaching Talat and if anything is completely ignoring all his calls for negotiations or even a informal coffee which to many seems like tassos is the stumbling block, i ask you what would tassos have to lose by meeting with talat apart from show the world and the Turkish Cypriot he is ready to negotiate.

If I was in Tassos' shoes, I would definitely have chosen to meet with Talat informally, in fact I would have gone as far as to informally "negotiate" the Cyprus problem, away from the defenses and constrictions that are inevitable in a formal negotiation process.

A process of "informal negotiation" would have brought about greater understanding between the leaders of the two communities, as well as nurturing the desire to find answers and solutions together.

I believe that what has been going wrong so far in Cyprus negotiations, is that "the sides" have been: 'Greek Cypriots with Greece', Vs 'Turkish Cypriots with Turkey'. We need to get past that, at the top level of leadership, until we reach 'Greek Cypriots and Turkish Cypriots together' Vs 'all others - EU, US, UN, Greece, Turkey'.

This, ofcourse, requires creative thinking and true statesmanship. I am not sure we have either quality to a sufficient extent at the moment ...

brother · Joined: 15 Aug 2005 Posts: 8920 Location: London/Cyprus

Quote: If I was in Tassos' shoes, I would definitely have chosen to meet with Talat informally, in fact I would have gone as far as to informally "negotiate" the Cyprus problem, away from the defenses and constrictions that are inevitable in a formal negotiation process.

A process of "informal negotiation" would have brought about greater understanding between the leaders of the two communities, as well as nurturing the desire to find answers and solutions together.

I believe that what has been going wrong so far in Cyprus negotiations, is that "the sides" have been: 'Greek Cypriots with Greece', Vs 'Turkish Cypriots with Turkey'. We need to get past that, at the top level of leadership, until we reach 'Greek Cypriots and Turkish Cypriots together' Vs 'all others - EU, US, UN, Greece, Turkey'.

This, ofcourse, requires creative thinking and true statesmanship. I am not sure we have either quality to a sufficient extent at the moment ...

So in short you agree that tassos is a stumbling block as he is not meeting with Talat hence everyone is right to see him as the main problem at the moment.