www.talkcyprus.org

[depurple]

Simple: Here we go again:
1: Turkey Joins the EU:
2: Talat take up his vice president:
3: The presidency will rotate ever year:
4: Equal number of Greek Cypriot & Turkish Cypriot in the government:
5: No weapons or military at all on Cyprus:Security will be a EU police force under EU rules and regulations: GREAT!
6: Freedom of movement, Speech & Religion:
7: All the damages to Cyprus will be supplied BY the Republic of Cyprus through the sale of the military:
Turkey, Greece, the UK and the EU:
8: One new Flag:
9:One New National Anthem:
10:Greek, Turkish and English will be taught in schools:
11: A indepentant committee from the EU will address the properties compensation, Missing people ect ect:
So when we are asked who WE ARE?
Gone is that Greek Cypriot & Turkish Cypriot or Greek OR Turk:
We are European!
From what country......Cyprus!
Come and visit one day BUT make sure you bring your wife, Girlfriend or daughter over 18!
Crikey!
PS Remember the EU will monitor the whole DAMN thing:
LIKE Big Bother!
I prefer Big Mother!

[repulsewarrior]

Sorry dep, I gotta say...

!. Take today's map, take a bag of jewels, throw them over the map, call the ones in the south Turkish Cypriot Cantons, and the ones in the north, call them Cantons by their original name.

2. Take two governments, one Turkish Cypriot, and one Greek Cypriot, and make them responsible to the Republic of Cyprus, by norm, while they are sovereign in providing the services that citizens need as communities, bi-zonally.

3. Reform the Constitution of the Republic of Cyprus, and include a bi-cameral legislature where each citizen has three votes withwhich they select from three lists of candidates: one Independant for the Lower House (which votes by consensus), one Turkish Cypriot Representative, and one Greek Cypriot Representative for the Upper House where a President can win for his party, government, by having a majority of seats in the evenly divided House. No need for a "Turkish" or "Greek" rotation, and the Party which provides the best candidates "Greek" and "Turkish" will have the best chance to win the majority.

4. Super-militarise the island, allow for the bases to be shared by our allies, Turkey, EU, and others, perhaps vast storage facilities and airlift capacity, with the personnel, in which the world needs to provide the humanitarian relief that these countries must provide.

So there you have it Bi-communal, and Bi-zonal.

Free Movement, Free Association, and Free Expression.



Cyprus is an island.

[depurple]

RW can I go back to Lapithos to live on MY land in your plan? let me know?
Also why Super-militarize the island? Give it to NATO! Then they can all Be happy BUT charge the bastards for using it!
Cheers

[depurple]

PS DEPURPLEs solution Number 2:
TURN Cyprus in to a big NUDIST COLONY:
If everyone walks around NAKED they will have nothing to hide!
Expect those who have a BIG reputation in front of them:
Cheers
PS you can wear Flip Flops BUT don't bend over in the street of someone might get the point!

[Cyprus rules!]

depurple wrote: PS DEPURPLEs solution Number 2:
TURN Cyprus in to a big NUDIST COLONY:
If everyone walks around NAKED they will have nothing to hide!
Expect those who have a BIG reputation in front of them:
Cheers
PS you can wear Flip Flops BUT don't bend over in the street of someone might get the point!

The best idea yet!!! :wink: :lol:

[stavrizatz]

hi everyone,

Very interesting responses, and f*** how frequent do you guys log on the site, don't you have other responsibilities!

Anyway back to the subject...firstly I am not from Australia, I am just studying here.

Now I understand why freedom of speech is so restricted in Turkey. Most people did not reply, but attacked my articled (Sorry for the generalisation but...). Most did not even respect my point of view which is shared by many Greek Cypriots. I guess it is ok to have an opinion, It's not like try to enforce them to you; I am only willing to discuss them.

Here is a response to every reply, I hope to cover everything…enjoy

To Bananiot:
You cannot say it was a referendum because there is much evidence that support its existence; I used wikipedia as my source because I didn’t want to use a Greek reference. Possibly the referendum was more in a form of an unofficial petition, but do not forget that Cyprus was under Britain and Britain wouldn’t allow a formal referendum. You cannot just say its all bullshit.

To Cypezokyli:
2. I mentioned that the sample was not significant to make conclusions and I did not expect those figures to be accurate! I wanted to make a point and my point was that from my group of friends those were the responses. Why don’t you question the polls on this website as well? The sample was 18 Greek Cypriots, 9 replied Union, 8 replied for free Cyprus, and 1 said he prefers a divided Cyprus. 11 Turkish Cypriots of whom 7 supported a free Cyprus based on some solution and 4 preferred Cyprus to be divided. Even one of my Turkish Cypriot friends agrees with me on almost everything but he is unsure about the Enosis thing.

4. Maybe is true, it would be better to stay in the sphere of reality, but I like to Dream sometimes.

To kifeas:
In regards the research, see comments above.

To Donald Keogh:
Defending its Borders: If you know of Cyprus History … did you know that since 1191 Cyprus lived freely and peacefully for only 3 years! If Cyprus was united with Greece after the liberation struggle, I believe that Cyprus today was going to be better of, without Turkey occupying 37% of the island.
I do not live 3000 miles away, I stay there and the person who does live in Australia is depurple whose knowledge about Cyprus, culture etc. seems very limited.

To depurple:
Hello my friend,
-You said Quote: You don't KNOW what you are talking about for me.
Is this an opinion or a fact? (you would probably say a fact!)
Quote: -You said: “As for the fairest solution: Simple:
1: No armies and goodbye in Cyprus:
2: Get rid of the Greek and Turkish Flags:
3: Also get rid of the people WHO do not consider themselves as Cypriots:
4: Open the boarder anbd everyone just blends in like every other civilized western country Is it so simple? Is this your opinion or a fact?
Quote: -The Turks of Thrace are treated like 2nd class citizens:
The Greeks treat the Cypriots as second class citizens: (Cypriot Donkeys)” It’s ridiculous! Is this a fact of your opinion?
Quote: Simple: Here we go again…
Not again…please men don’t be so close-minded, be more open to other possibilities
p.s. why do you hate Greeks so much?


To Zan:
Quote: It seems that no one has been able to provide the proof so support for your argument is not valid. The referendum did happen, Makarios started it, the place where people signed is irrelevant, I know people who voted in the referendum, and my fathers who comes from a mixed village does know Turkish Cypriots who voted in the referendum. Possibly the figures of Wikipedia are not accurate however the fact is that the extreme majority of Cypriots at the times wanted Cyprus to be liberated are liberation at the time meant re-union with Greece. Cyprus to exist as independent it was an idea of the British who divided their colonies into smaller nations – easier to control.

About the Turks in Thrace, you have no proof to base your beliefs Quote: Turks suffer a host of human rights violations . This guy experience the life in Komotini for 5 years.

To Repulsewarrior:
Very respectful your ideas.
Quote: In my mind the Cyprus Problem will be resolved once Turkey is accommodated, regarding their security militarily from the threat that the island poses I agree.

About voting: why only Turkish Cypriots have an issue with being a minority ethnic group – what about the Maronites and the Armenians and the British, aren’t they a minority group. In fact a British – Cypriot citizen wanted to become the mayor of Pafos! I know it is naïve to think that a Turkish could become the president of Cyprus even if he is the best for the position but for example can a Spanish speaker become the president of the United States?
I don’t know and that is the issue with democracy!

Quote: We are committed, according to what is said by the leadership, to find a solution which is bi-zonal and bi-communal
My topic was clearly talking about my beliefs of the “fairest solution”, my beliefs about the most feasible solutions are surely based on a bi-communal structure. I believe there should be bi-zonal country for a transitional period of time and then eventually get rid of the nationalistic views and become one multicultural country.
My idea of Enosis was after this period of time if it was to occur and if it does it would be based on the model of Hong Kong with China where only foreign policy and defense is common.

Quote: how do you know that this is not an attempt at dividing those with a similar problem (from a different point of view) and those that will choose to be tolerant and reasoned. Yes I can say it is an attempt to show a different point of view of a large proportion of the Cyprus population. I thought there will be a reaction but not as such.

To 100%Cypriot:
Cyprus as an independent country existed for only 46 years. Cyprus as a nation it only starts developing in the past two decades. Cypriot nationalism is a modern era. Nationalism is also a very recent phenomenon globally. 100%Cypriot I will answer to you I am a 100% human. I feel I belong in Cyprus but do not feel I am 100% Cypriot; I am just an anarchist hippy that is passionate about global love. People who believe in global love are possibly from another planet. My views of Enosis are purely not nationalistic but just an opinion. If Turkey improves it standards of Human rights I wouldn’t mind living in a Cyprus united to Turkey.


To S300:
I totally agree with the idea of transitional period but 100 years maybe is too long, please see comments to repulsewarrior. All these ideas are just different possibilities that could be good.


Hey guys before going I would like to comment on the poll. 8 voted, and there are 8 who posted comments, this means three voted for the islands division! I assume at least 6 of the 8 of are Turkish Cypriots so the result of this poll is fairly similar to the one of my mini survey!

[cypezokyli]

Quote: Now I understand why freedom of speech is so restricted in Turkey. Most people did not reply, but attacked my articled (Sorry for the generalisation but...). Most did not even respect my point of view which is shared by many Greek Cypriots. I guess it is ok to have an opinion, It's not like try to enforce them to you; I am only willing to discuss them.


being for a while in the forum i can assure you that most of the answers you received are from Greek Cypriots (myself, bananiot, kifeas, rw, s300 and dp), and none is either a turk or currently living in turkey. you started from a stereotype you (obviously) have and came to a conclusion about where people come from. not to mention that you assumed that everyone not agreeing is from turkey !!!!

as for your research, i would also direct you to a number of polls, made by a mamber of the forum, on a scientific basis :
http://www.cypruspolls.org/

........
and once again dont be so sure, about the situation in thrace...
here are some articles in greek for you :
http://www.google.com/search?q=%CE%B8%CF%81%CE%B1%CE%BA%CE%B7+%CE%BC%CE%B5%CE%B9%CE%BF%CE%BD%CE%BF%CF%84%CE%B7%CF%84%CE%B1&hl=de&lr=&oe=windows-1253&inlang=el&domains=www.iospress.gr&sitesearch=www.iospress.gr&start=0&sa=N


..........
and lastly, this is a book that i am currently reading
Michael Attalides, Cyprus. Nationalism and International Politics
and it seriously challanges the idea of "fair" demand for enosis, since that fair demand was apparently created by specific members of society with influence, that hat interests at this kind of solution. moreoever as he argues, under the umbrella of enosis, different ttargets and meanings were often hidden.

have a nice day.... and you can join us more often... that is....if there is freedom of access to net whereever you are currently living :wink:

[cypezokyli]

Quote:
Hey guys before going I would like to comment on the poll. 8 voted, and there are 8 who posted comments, this means three voted for the islands division! I assume at least 6 of the 8 of are Turkish Cypriots so the result of this poll is fairly similar to the one of my mini survey!

i already said above that most of the naswers, (i dont know about the votes) , are from Greek Cypriots.

as for me i didnot vote, bc i donot consider internet polls as being something that i can draw conclusions from.

[depurple]

stavrizatz
I dont hate Greeks: I hate others as well for interfering on our island:
Greece has its own boarders and go help there OWN people ON their OWN islands who are crying: Look at the people from:
Chios:
Kos:
Zankithos:
Poros:
And many other island who do not has proper school, doctors and electricity?
We Cypriots had this before Greece did!
And you want to be part of a Nation who would turn a blind eye to ITS own Greek people:
Look at the Macedonian from Florina: My mother is Macedonian: Ask them about Greece:
Having said this Turkey isn't any better with the Armenians, Kurds and other minorities: And Britain with the Irish, Welsh and the Scotts:
So which one do we join?
Give me break:
we have a country:
Our own identity:
Our own great customs and family values:
We are better than Greece, Turkey and the UK: they are jealous of our way of life and our beautiful country and you say be a part of one of them:
stravrOzatz my simple answer to you is what I tell all warped thinking caught in a time warp drongos:
FOR $150 bucks to can go live in Greece and save us the National mother hood bullshit and leave Cyprus to the Cypriots:
OH Lord Save us from these dreamers!
Crikey!
PS Beam him up scotty BUT this time with his brain!

[Birkibrisli]

Dear Stavro,

With all due respect to your right to free speech and freedom of expression;after all the heartache and misery and terror and distruction of lives in Cyprus since 1950s,are you seriously suggesting that the answer to the Cyprus problem is union with Greece (aka ENOSIS)???

I suppose I should not be that surprised,because after all the abovementioned disasters some people's answer to the Cypro is still Partition (aka TAKSIM)!!!

As they say,the More Things Change...the more they Stay the Same.
What a shame! :( :( :(

[stavrizatz]

To Cypezokyli
Ofcourse I did not assume that everyone who dissagreed was Turkish but the truth is that I assumed that everyone who doubt the situation in Thrace and the referendum of 1950 was.
Actually I am surprised that you and bananiot are Greek.

Anyway I apologise for my mistake, I shouldn't speak like that in forums but some comments really pissed me off.

In regards to Thrace younger people do not really care and their lifestyles are similar to any other Greek. There is no descrimination and the opportunities are same. In the past it was different and some older people still have different way of thinking but generally there is harmony in Thrace so why not in Cyprus.

[depurple]

stavrizatz
It surprises me that you are Greek and NOT CYPRIOT!
I am born in Australia and my father is also Australian BUT my grandfather came to Australia in 1923 from Lapithos and I consider myself Cypriot!
Strange world we are living in!
cheers
PS In 2006 Freedom of Speech has given many Greeks, Turks and Greek Cypriot and Turkish Cypriot a real headache!
Specially by those who call themselves CYPRIOTS!
CRIKEY!

[Kifeas]

I cannot believe that even after Cyprus accession to the EU as one of the 25 equal members of a Union of independed states, some of which are among the world’s political, economic and military superpowers, there are still people so far detached with reality, sense and rationality as to argue on the basis of Cyprus Union with Greece as an alternative to a solution; and that there are people that keep taking them seriously and counter argue with them on this basis.

[Cyprus rules!]

Hi Stavrizatz, I can sort of understand your idea of a 'Democratic Enosis'...... but why do you feel that it's an option, I mean wouldn't it cause even more problems?

[cypezokyli]

stavrizatz wrote: To Cypezokyli
Ofcourse I did not assume that everyone who dissagreed was Turkish but the truth is that I assumed that everyone who doubt the situation in Thrace and the referendum of 1950 was.
Actually I am surprised that you and bananiot are Greek.

Anyway I apologise for my mistake, I shouldn't speak like that in forums but some comments really pissed me off.

In regards to Thrace younger people do not really care and their lifestyles are similar to any other Greek. There is no descrimination and the opportunities are same. In the past it was different and some older people still have different way of thinking but generally there is harmony in Thrace so why not in Cyprus.

well me and bananiot are not greek.
we are cypriots :wink:

what is doubted is the idea of a "referendum" (like the one of 2004) showing the will of the cypriot people. it was not a ballot, and only Greek Cypriots voted. there is noone that argues that the will of the Greek Cypriots at that point in time was in favor of enosis. but this is not all the cypriot people. :wink:

as for thrace...if bg_turk pops up , you will be sorry to ever started with the subject :lol: . it is beyond doubt, that greece has no clean record when it comes to how it treated the minorities. that was ofcource a reaction to how turkey treated the greek minority and the cycle never ended. but it is a matter of fact that a bar used to exist when people from the minority wanted to enter their villages. it is a matter of fact that certain racist laws were used against the muslim minority. now you may reply what turkey does and that it is worse - i dont doubt that, but still, that doesnot excuse the actions of the greek goverments.
you should really check that, bc there are even reports from international organisations. as i said above the last 10 years ther has been a significant improvement but there are still things to be done. it is not bad to admit that, and believe me, it in no way reduces your "greekness". on the contrary, the closest you are to the truth, the more "greek" you are....or ?