| Should we apologise for past demenours???? |
| Yes as it is the way forward. |
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66% |
[ 14 ] |
| No i don't think so. |
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9% |
[ 2 ] |
| They got what they deserved and its better this way. |
|
14% |
[ 3 ] |
| I don't care |
|
9% |
[ 2 ] |
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| Total Votes : 21 |
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| Author |
Message |
depurple
Warnings : 1
Ministerial
Joined: 06 Dec 2005
Posts: 2876
Location: Australia
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Kifreas that EOKA poison has got a grip on you MATE and you can not let it go can you?
Its a bit like the Turks with the Armenian genocide:
They wont admit that Turkey made mistakes and you wont admit that EOKA A & B destroyed Cyprus:
EOKA A:
Because of what EOKA A did to the British the British turned a blind eye to Turkeys invasion: Makarios and Grivas knew that the British only wanted Cyprus of a year or tow more to protect the SUEZ BUT no! They both wanted POWER NOW!
Again Turkey would NEVER had Invaded Cyprus IF Britain was still in Power: they would of sent Turkey into the Dark ages! GWB to Pakistan 2006!
EOKA B:
Fools who didn't have an idea what they wanted: Some EOKA B wanted the Communist dead:
Some EOKA B wanted the Turkish Cypriot dead:
Some EOKA B wanted kill all the British:
Some EOKA B wanted to kill there relatives out of jealously:
OH Yes some wanted ENOSIS with Greece even thou Greece don't want this!
Amazing!
Kifreas forget this EOKA bullshit and lets concentrate on 2006:
While I am here Erolz don't give us historical lectures save that for your children and grandchildren:
I don't want to here about the madmen on both sides of the boarder who divided Cyprus and beside this you waste you time with hard liners of EOKA & TMT! Cheers |
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erolz
Site Admin
Joined: 11 Aug 2005
Posts: 4195
Location: Kyrenia / Girne
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| Kifeas wrote: |
| Papadopoulos during the Eoka struggle (1955-58 ) was between 19-23 years old, and was assigned duties in the propaganda warfare, i.e. writing, publishing and distributing propaganda material such as the above magazine. Within this scope of duties, he may have written articles justifying or explaining murders of people by Eoka, upon instructions from higher ranks. I find it impossible and unbelievable that a 20 or a 22 year old man was given the power and the authority by the Eoka hierarchy and Grivas to decide alone and order such executions. Anyone that claims such a hilarious and preposterous thing does so only deliberately, in order to undermine the current president of the Republic and the Greek Cypriot cause in general! |
How old was Rauf Denktash at this time? I presume you have little trouble believing that he was a leader of TMT or involved in the ordering of peoples executions?
So if TP did not decide alone who should be executed , but it was decided by a comittiee of murderers then that is ok ? |
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erolz
Site Admin
Joined: 11 Aug 2005
Posts: 4195
Location: Kyrenia / Girne
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| stavrizatz wrote: |
Erolz,
Well, yes there were a number of killings towards Cypriots for opposing the acts of Eoka. However during liberation struggles and wars there is fanatisism and 'the most innocent man can do the most horrific crime'. Eoka as an organisation did not have civilian targets. The fact that civilians were killed, was either by accident or by individual fighters or maybe even leaders acting on their own behalf of 'immorality'. These individual crimes cannot justify Eoka as a evil and immoral organisation." |
I did not call EOKA as an organisation evil and immoral. I said it was a terrorist organisation because it sought to and used fear violence and intimidation (terror) as a means of trying to achieve poltical objectives (political).
| stavrizatz wrote: |
The scope of Eoka was beyond the killings and the purpose was the liberation of Cyprus, hense Liberation struggle. |
And again I point out the madness of seeking liberation by seeking to transfer sovereignty from one foreign power to another.
| stavrizatz wrote: |
No-one can blame the organisation for demanding Enosis as Cypriots lived a different reality than today. The reality of the people at the time was that Cyprus was not a sovereign country but just another Greek island. In fact in the early 20th century many Greek islands were fighting for Enosis with Greece, just like Cyprus. There were other attempts and demonstration striving towards enosis prior Eoka eg. October 1933. It is naive to support that Makarios started the whole idea of Enosis. |
Who said Makarios started the whole ENOSIS idea? Certainly not me. I can accept that for Cypriots in the 20's and 30's who wanted an end of British rule - Union with Greece may have seemed a rational and feasible route to attain that goal. However by 1950 it was abundantly clear that if Cypriots wanted the end of British rule then independence was the most sensible and achievable way of securing this and that ENOSIS was unrealistic and continued demand for it only blocked and undermined the chances of an end to British rule.
The 'reality' that at the time cyprus was 'just another Greek Island' is a reality only in the heads of Greeks and Greek Cypriot. In the heads of the British cyprus was not 'just another Greek island'. In the heads of the Turkish Cypriots it was not 'just another Greek Island' and in the heads of people from Turkey it was not 'just another Greek Island'.
My view is that the pursuit of ENOSIS (and not independence) by the Greek Cypriot community in the 50's and beyond was disastrous for Cypriots. I believe that ENOSIS was a reflection of Greek nationalism fostered in Cyprus by Greek nationalist over 100+ years through Greek controlled education in Cyprus and the Greek orthodox church. I believe that enosis by 1950 was not a rational choice for Cypriots in terms of what was best for Cypriots (not what was best for Greeks) and neither was it a rational way to seek the end of British rule in Cyprus. I believe in short the words of Makarios when he said 'It is in the name of ENOSIS that Cyprus has been destroyed'.
| stavrizatz wrote: |
Sorry Cyprus, your opinion respectful but I totally dissagree with your view of Eoka. I believe there are more important things we need to 'apologise for' acknoledge. Eoka B is a different story! |
EOKA - a terrorist organisation headed by Grivas that sought ENOSIS and pursued it through the use of violence and terror.
EOKA B - a terrorist orgnaisation headed by Grivas that sought ENOSIS and pursued it through the use of violence and terror.
A different story but one with remarkable similarites. |
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depurple
Warnings : 1
Ministerial
Joined: 06 Dec 2005
Posts: 2876
Location: Australia
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I just hope they set up a committee than can bring and make ALL EOKA B and TMT accountable for their foolish and somewhat crazy ways of thinking!
PS but the money was bloody (AND I MEAN BLOODY) good for some!
cheers
PS I believe they still get it even today!
But that's a question for Clerides and Denktash: |
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Kifeas
Warnings : 6
Ministerial
Joined: 26 Aug 2005
Posts: 2733
Location: Location: Pafos-Cyprus, since 1974 ethnic cleansing. Originally, Lapithos, northern occupied Cyprus.
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| erolz wrote: |
| Kifeas wrote: |
| Papadopoulos during the Eoka struggle (1955-58 ) was between 19-23 years old, and was assigned duties in the propaganda warfare, i.e. writing, publishing and distributing propaganda material such as the above magazine. Within this scope of duties, he may have written articles justifying or explaining murders of people by Eoka, upon instructions from higher ranks. I find it impossible and unbelievable that a 20 or a 22 year old man was given the power and the authority by the Eoka hierarchy and Grivas to decide alone and order such executions. Anyone that claims such a hilarious and preposterous thing does so only deliberately, in order to undermine the current president of the Republic and the Greek Cypriot cause in general! |
How old was Rauf Denktash at this time? I presume you have little trouble believing that he was a leader of TMT or involved in the ordering of peoples executions?
So if TP did not decide alone who should be executed , but it was decided by a comittiee of murderers then that is ok ? |
Denktash is at least 10 years older than Papadopoulos.
I said that Papadopoulos did not decide on anyone's murder, neither alone nor as a member of a committee for this purpose. I wonder why you implied the above “cleverish” insinuation, since nowhere I indicated that he may have done so as part of a joined committee, but to the contrary I said that such decisions were made by Grivas and /or his area commanders. Papadopoulos was not an area commander, nor was he a member in the fighting ranks of Eoka. Papadopoulos was engaged in a non-armed auxiliary association of Eoka, responsible for the preparation and circulation of propaganda material. |
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Bananiot
Warnings : 1
Deputy
Joined: 13 Aug 2005
Posts: 1214
Location: Nicosia
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During the EOKA struggle, young Papadopoulos was in charge of PEKA (Pancyprian Committee for the Struggle). In July 2002 he gave an interview to "Selides".
"My task, he said, was to inflitrate and control all organisations with our men".
Practically, young Papadopoulos was in charge of a broad network of informers who basically collected information from clubs and organisation, mainly of the left. Young Papadopoulos had the job of evaluating all the information that came to him and send his judgement (who dies and who lives) to Grivas.
Grivas gave the final orders for the assasinations and Papadopoulos was then responsible for justifying them.
All the above have been reported in a number of newspapers and books and no one ever questioned them. |
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zan
Warnings : 2
Mukhtar/is
Joined: 31 Dec 2005
Posts: 962
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| Quote: |
Denktash is at least 10 years older than Papadopoulos.
I said that Papadopoulos did not decide on anyone's murder, neither alone nor as a member of a committee for this purpose. I wonder why you implied the above “cleverish” insinuation, since nowhere I indicated that he may have done so as part of a joined committee, but to the contrary I said that such decisions were made by Grivas and /or his area commanders. Papadopoulos was not an area commander, nor was he a member in the fighting ranks of Eoka. Papadopoulos was engaged in a non-armed auxiliary association of Eoka, responsible for the preparation and circulation of propaganda material. |
I have been googling all night trying to find any articles or pictures where Papadopoulos was marching through the streets protesting against these murders, but to no avail. Oh! I forgot he was far too busy doing his paper round delivering news papers and propaganda leaflets. I wonder if he was into graffiti as well.
How many divisions will be claimed for this thing called EOKA.
EOKA-A
EOKA-B
Propagandists
Tea- lady
Issuer of first warnings
Issuer of second warning
Executioner
Leader
If we carry on like this there will be no one to blame. Eh! Kifeas  |
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Kifeas
Warnings : 6
Ministerial
Joined: 26 Aug 2005
Posts: 2733
Location: Location: Pafos-Cyprus, since 1974 ethnic cleansing. Originally, Lapithos, northern occupied Cyprus.
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| zan wrote: |
| Quote: |
Denktash is at least 10 years older than Papadopoulos.
I said that Papadopoulos did not decide on anyone's murder, neither alone nor as a member of a committee for this purpose. I wonder why you implied the above “cleverish” insinuation, since nowhere I indicated that he may have done so as part of a joined committee, but to the contrary I said that such decisions were made by Grivas and /or his area commanders. Papadopoulos was not an area commander, nor was he a member in the fighting ranks of Eoka. Papadopoulos was engaged in a non-armed auxiliary association of Eoka, responsible for the preparation and circulation of propaganda material. |
I have been googling all night trying to find any articles or pictures where Papadopoulos was marching through the streets protesting against these murders, but to no avail. Oh! I forgot he was far too busy doing his paper round delivering news papers and propaganda leaflets. I wonder if he was into graffiti as well.
How many divisions will be claimed for this thing called EOKA.
EOKA-A
EOKA-B
Propagandists
Tea- lady
Issuer of first warnings
Issuer of second warning
Executioner
Leader
If we carry on like this there will be no one to blame. Eh! Kifeas |
Zan, unfortunatelly I only respond to posts of people possesing a certain IQ level an above. |
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Kifeas
Warnings : 6
Ministerial
Joined: 26 Aug 2005
Posts: 2733
Location: Location: Pafos-Cyprus, since 1974 ethnic cleansing. Originally, Lapithos, northern occupied Cyprus.
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| Bananiot wrote: |
During the EOKA struggle, young Papadopoulos was in charge of PEKA (Pancyprian Committee for the Struggle). In July 2002 he gave an interview to "Selides".
"My task, he said, was to inflitrate and control all organisations with our men".
Practically, young Papadopoulos was in charge of a broad network of informers who basically collected information from clubs and organisation, mainly of the left. Young Papadopoulos had the job of evaluating all the information that came to him and send his judgement (who dies and who lives) to Grivas.
Grivas gave the final orders for the assasinations and Papadopoulos was then responsible for justifying them.
All the above have been reported in a number of newspapers and books and no one ever questioned them. |
Apart from a couple of Edy (your party) supporters (Sofokleous & CIA,) no one serious has ever claimed that his role was what you described. A careful look at your above darkened sentence -quote from “Selides,” and at the subsequent paragraphs, which represent your own words, will confirm that the two things (what he said his role was and what you imply) have no relation with each other. |
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Bananiot
Warnings : 1
Deputy
Joined: 13 Aug 2005
Posts: 1214
Location: Nicosia
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Well, well! Try speaking to the families of the murdered people. Tofarides from Koma toy Yialou, Menoikos from Lefkonoiko, just to mention a couple.
Your protege is a sick shauvinist and a most reactionary person. He is doing his utmost to achieve the partition of Cyprus and it was no accident that Christofias was forced to utter that "the man has changed". This did not come out of the blue. The members of AKEL must know something. How has he changed? From what has he changed? |
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Chapfallen
Warnings : 7
Senior Villager
Joined: 18 Sep 2006
Posts: 464
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| He changes his underwear. His wearing a blue string and now he is wearing a red- blue sovrako. |
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GeorgiosGrivasDigenis
Villager
Joined: 01 Oct 2006
Posts: 7
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| depurple wrote: |
Kifreas that EOKA poison has got a grip on you MATE and you can not let it go can you?
Its a bit like the Turks with the Armenian genocide:
They wont admit that Turkey made mistakes and you wont admit that EOKA A & B destroyed Cyprus:
EOKA A:
Because of what EOKA A did to the British the British turned a blind eye to Turkeys invasion: Makarios and Grivas knew that the British only wanted Cyprus of a year or tow more to protect the SUEZ BUT no! They both wanted POWER NOW!
Again Turkey would NEVER had Invaded Cyprus IF Britain was still in Power: they would of sent Turkey into the Dark ages! GWB to Pakistan 2006!
EOKA B:
Fools who didn't have an idea what they wanted: Some EOKA B wanted the Communist dead:
Some EOKA B wanted the Turkish Cypriot dead:
Some EOKA B wanted kill all the British:
Some EOKA B wanted to kill there relatives out of jealously:
OH Yes some wanted ENOSIS with Greece even thou Greece don't want this!
Amazing!
Kifreas forget this EOKA bullshit and lets concentrate on 2006:
While I am here Erolz don't give us historical lectures save that for your children and grandchildren:
I don't want to here about the madmen on both sides of the boarder who divided Cyprus and beside this you waste you time with hard liners of EOKA & TMT! Cheers |
i disagree with you brother coz :
EOKA A AND EOKA B WANTED ONLY ENOSIS AND ONLY ENOSIS WITH GREECE ...and we dont forget ...1974 |
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depurple
Warnings : 1
Ministerial
Joined: 06 Dec 2005
Posts: 2876
Location: Australia
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GGD unfortunately you are not alone there are many misguide fools such as yourself:
What I would like to do is thank you for your part in the division of Cyprus:
And as many EOKAB & TMT say so what!
You see with me my grandfather cane to Australia in 1922 and then settled back in Cypurs in 1972 and them lost everything because a few CLOWNS thought that joining Greece OR Turkey was the best for Cyprus:
After my grandfather died a broken man I swore on his grave that anyone Greek Cypriot or Turkish Cypriot that thinks he can get a way with miss-justice or sheer dumb blindness would have to answer to me:
As you see call me Robin Hood:
I just want to make sure that day dreamers and fanatic have me watching them and the great thing of living in a democracy I can make people such as yourself be accountable for one STUPIDITY with Cyprus: So keep posting BUT I am reading you between the lines: Or should I say I try to read many Greek Cypriot & Turkish Cypriot between the lines BECAUSE I am unique I am Cypriot so therefore Greece and Turkey are just a bubble in my beer!
cheers!
PS a bit of advice don't always believe what your father and grandfather have polluted your brain with: Think for yourself and you might be witness to a United Free Cyprus very soon:
BUT then again MAYBE you are one of those who support Division and if you send me your bank account a can TT the tickets to Greece and you can go live there and salute the Greek flag everyday of the week BUT don't THINK (That might be Hard for you) that the majority of the Greek Cypriot think like you because if they did you wouldn't have lost your ENOSIS bullshit with a country who doesn't give a shit about you: Yes Greece):
CRIKEY!
PS again: Sorry about that BUT Greece doesn't give a shit about their own Greeks in the North or on the smaller islands and they where going to think about the Cypriot DONKEYS!
Don't make me laugh! OR should I say cry over some people stupidity! |
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brother
Warnings : 3
Site Admin
Joined: 15 Aug 2005
Posts: 8920
Location: London/Cyprus
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| GeorgiosGrivasDigenis wrote: |
| depurple wrote: |
Kifreas that EOKA poison has got a grip on you MATE and you can not let it go can you?
Its a bit like the Turks with the Armenian genocide:
They wont admit that Turkey made mistakes and you wont admit that EOKA A & B destroyed Cyprus:
EOKA A:
Because of what EOKA A did to the British the British turned a blind eye to Turkeys invasion: Makarios and Grivas knew that the British only wanted Cyprus of a year or tow more to protect the SUEZ BUT no! They both wanted POWER NOW!
Again Turkey would NEVER had Invaded Cyprus IF Britain was still in Power: they would of sent Turkey into the Dark ages! GWB to Pakistan 2006!
EOKA B:
Fools who didn't have an idea what they wanted: Some EOKA B wanted the Communist dead:
Some EOKA B wanted the Turkish Cypriot dead:
Some EOKA B wanted kill all the British:
Some EOKA B wanted to kill there relatives out of jealously:
OH Yes some wanted ENOSIS with Greece even thou Greece don't want this!
Amazing!
Kifreas forget this EOKA bullshit and lets concentrate on 2006:
While I am here Erolz don't give us historical lectures save that for your children and grandchildren:
I don't want to here about the madmen on both sides of the boarder who divided Cyprus and beside this you waste you time with hard liners of EOKA & TMT! Cheers |
i disagree with you brother coz :
EOKA A AND EOKA B WANTED ONLY ENOSIS AND ONLY ENOSIS WITH GREECE ...and we dont forget ...1974 |
I wish that was the whole truth but if you keep an open mind and do some onvestigating and look for the truth then you will find that their ambitions were not as honourable as you have been led to believe.
Also do you not forget 1963-1974 as this was also a crucial time. |
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repulsewarrior
Deputy
Joined: 06 Jan 2006
Posts: 1735
Location: Canada
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| GGD are you my cousin? Is our great uncle, brother of the man still alive. He fought for independance, but he was never a member of Eoka b. If it was possible he would cry, because he is ashamed of the misguided fools who thought the fight was just, and everyone who fought was righteous. He suffers, do you know him, or like his wife, do you consider him a coward because he says nothing, he has no lust, and he fought no more? |
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