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Bananiot Warnings : 1 Deputy

Joined: 13 Aug 2005 Posts: 1214 Location: Nicosia
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The following is an excerpt from the memoirs of George Ball. Ball was one of America's premier diplomats in the 1960s. He was Under Secretary of State in 1964 when he became involved in the Cyprus problem. The excerpt refers to a meeting with Makarios.
Meetings with His Beatitude
I arrived to find Nicosia an armed camp with barbed wire demarcating a so-called "green line" separating the Greek and Turkish communities. Access from one zone to another was restricted to designated check points. Jeeps containing British forces with tommy guns and Cypriot police roamed the area and patrolled the neutral zone that lay between the separate rolls of barbed wire.
On my first meeting with His Beatitude (as Archbishop Makarios was addressed) on February 12, I was accompanied by Joseph Sisco, the Assistant Secretary of State for International Organization Affairs; his deputy. Jack Jernagan; and Frazer Wilkins, the United States Ambassador to Cyprus. British interests were brilliantly represented by Sir Cyril Pickard, Assistant Under Secretary of State for the Commonwealth Relations Office, who was, at the time. Acting High Commissioner for Cyprus. Makarios received us on the porch of his residence, formerly the residence of the British colonial governor. Resplendent in the full regalia of his ecclesiastical office, he wore a tall black head-covering with a mantia in the rear, while about his neck was a gold chain, from which depended a large medallion known as a panagia. It contained a representation of Christ holding a book in his left hand while the fingers of the right hand were frozen in the gesture of giving blessing. Resting on the Archbishop's chest, the medallion symbolized a "confessor from the heart" to remind the wearer that he was always to have God in his heart. I saw few signs of that in the days that followed.
After the traditional tiresome pleasantries, the Archbishop led us to his study, where he went through an astonishing striptease, removing his gold chain, his head covering, and his robes until reduced to shirt sleeves. Newspaper pictures of the Archbishop, with his beard and clerical trappings, had given me an impression of a venerable ecclesiastic. Now I found myself facing a tough, cynical man of fifty-one, far more suited to temporal command than spiritual inspiration. (As I commented later to President Johnson, "He must be cheating about his age; no one could acquire so much guile in only fifty-one years.") Since he had spent some months in a seminary near Boston, he spoke only slightly accented English, and his conversation was marked by a whimsical, often macabre humour that both amused and appalled me. Of medium height, with eyes that peered through narrow eyelids, he seemed about to relish the fencing match in which we were to engage.
Our morning meeting was relatively calm and uneventful. As we explained our respective positions, Makarios gave nothing away. When we parted for lunch, he carefully rerobed, putting on all his paraphernalia for the photographers who assaulted us on the porch: when we returned for our afternoon meeting, he once again repeated his strip- tease.
I can describe the afternoon session only as "bloody." The Archbishop was unrelenting in repeating a litany he knew I would never accept. The whole matter must be submitted to the UN Security Council; and the United Nations must guarantee the political independence and territorial integrity of Cyprus. That meant, as I told my British colleague later, that Makarios's central interest was to block off Turkish intervention so that he and his Greek Cypriots could go on happily massacring Turkish Cypriotes. Obviously we would never permit that.
Much to my delight, my British colleague, Sir Cyril Pickard, proved tough and resourceful. In the great tradition of British proconsuls, he was deeply dedicated to stopping the wanton killing and returning peace to the island. Nor did he bother with diplomatic politesse in expressing his contempt for the bloody-mindedness that Makarios and his government were displaying. After Pickard had denounced the Archbishop in devastating language for the outrages inflicted on the Turkish Cypriots, I spent the next forty-five minutes telling off Makarios and his ministers. I spoke, as I telegraphed the President that night, "in a fashion remote from diplomatic exchanges," describing in lurid detail the consequences if he persisted in his cruel and reckless conduct. The Turks, I said, would inevitably invade, and neither the United States nor any other Western power would raise a finger to stop them. Though Makarios tried to conceal his discomfiture, I had the odd feeling as we left the room that, as I reported to the President, "even his beard seemed pale."
That night I conversed with the President and Secretary Rusk through the scrambledCand hence secureCteletype in the embassy, telling them that, in my view, a blow-up was exceedingly possible and that overwhelming pressure must be brought on Makarios "to frighten him sufficiently to consider some move to halt the killing." |
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Kifeas Warnings : 6 Ministerial

Joined: 26 Aug 2005 Posts: 2732 Location: Location: Pafos-Cyprus, since 1974 ethnic cleansing. Originally, Lapithos, northern occupied Cyprus.
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| Bananiot wrote: |
The following is an excerpt from the memoirs of George Ball. Ball was one of America's premier diplomats in the 1960s. He was Under Secretary of State in 1964 when he became involved in the Cyprus problem. The excerpt refers to a meeting with Makarios.
Meetings with His Beatitude
I arrived to find Nicosia an armed camp with barbed wire demarcating a so-called "green line" separating the Greek and Turkish communities. Access from one zone to another was restricted to designated check points. Jeeps containing British forces with tommy guns and Cypriot police roamed the area and patrolled the neutral zone that lay between the separate rolls of barbed wire.
On my first meeting with His Beatitude (as Archbishop Makarios was addressed) on February 12, I was accompanied by Joseph Sisco, the Assistant Secretary of State for International Organization Affairs; his deputy. Jack Jernagan; and Frazer Wilkins, the United States Ambassador to Cyprus. British interests were brilliantly represented by Sir Cyril Pickard, Assistant Under Secretary of State for the Commonwealth Relations Office, who was, at the time. Acting High Commissioner for Cyprus. Makarios received us on the porch of his residence, formerly the residence of the British colonial governor. Resplendent in the full regalia of his ecclesiastical office, he wore a tall black head-covering with a mantia in the rear, while about his neck was a gold chain, from which depended a large medallion known as a panagia. It contained a representation of Christ holding a book in his left hand while the fingers of the right hand were frozen in the gesture of giving blessing. Resting on the Archbishop's chest, the medallion symbolized a "confessor from the heart" to remind the wearer that he was always to have God in his heart. I saw few signs of that in the days that followed.
After the traditional tiresome pleasantries, the Archbishop led us to his study, where he went through an astonishing striptease, removing his gold chain, his head covering, and his robes until reduced to shirt sleeves. Newspaper pictures of the Archbishop, with his beard and clerical trappings, had given me an impression of a venerable ecclesiastic. Now I found myself facing a tough, cynical man of fifty-one, far more suited to temporal command than spiritual inspiration. (As I commented later to President Johnson, "He must be cheating about his age; no one could acquire so much guile in only fifty-one years.") Since he had spent some months in a seminary near Boston, he spoke only slightly accented English, and his conversation was marked by a whimsical, often macabre humour that both amused and appalled me. Of medium height, with eyes that peered through narrow eyelids, he seemed about to relish the fencing match in which we were to engage.
Our morning meeting was relatively calm and uneventful. As we explained our respective positions, Makarios gave nothing away. When we parted for lunch, he carefully rerobed, putting on all his paraphernalia for the photographers who assaulted us on the porch: when we returned for our afternoon meeting, he once again repeated his strip- tease.
I can describe the afternoon session only as "bloody." The Archbishop was unrelenting in repeating a litany he knew I would never accept. The whole matter must be submitted to the UN Security Council; and the United Nations must guarantee the political independence and territorial integrity of Cyprus. That meant, as I told my British colleague later, that Makarios's central interest was to block off Turkish intervention so that he and his Greek Cypriots could go on happily massacring Turkish Cypriotes. Obviously we would never permit that.
Much to my delight, my British colleague, Sir Cyril Pickard, proved tough and resourceful. In the great tradition of British proconsuls, he was deeply dedicated to stopping the wanton killing and returning peace to the island. Nor did he bother with diplomatic politesse in expressing his contempt for the bloody-mindedness that Makarios and his government were displaying. After Pickard had denounced the Archbishop in devastating language for the outrages inflicted on the Turkish Cypriots, I spent the next forty-five minutes telling off Makarios and his ministers. I spoke, as I telegraphed the President that night, "in a fashion remote from diplomatic exchanges," describing in lurid detail the consequences if he persisted in his cruel and reckless conduct. The Turks, I said, would inevitably invade, and neither the United States nor any other Western power would raise a finger to stop them. Though Makarios tried to conceal his discomfiture, I had the odd feeling as we left the room that, as I reported to the President, "even his beard seemed pale."
That night I conversed with the President and Secretary Rusk through the scrambledCand hence secureCteletype in the embassy, telling them that, in my view, a blow-up was exceedingly possible and that overwhelming pressure must be brought on Makarios "to frighten him sufficiently to consider some move to halt the killing." |
Bananiot, why did you post the above? What is your objective -assuming you indeed have one? |
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pg
Deputy

Joined: 17 Jan 2006 Posts: 1485 Location: Cyprus
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Bananiot Warnings : 1 Deputy

Joined: 13 Aug 2005 Posts: 1214 Location: Nicosia
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My objective ... ? Let us say I hate the hero aura we have built around Makarios. George Ball strips down Makarios of this aura and we can at last see him in the light of reality. Further and more important, it sheds light on the personality of the man but also it helps us reach the truth for a period which was and still is shrouded with mist and strong sentiments that make the seeking of truth very difficult.
However, most important, it shows how capable we are of repeating the mistakes of the past. Papadopoulos basically carries on the Makarios policies and today he is more at loggerheads with the Angloamericans than Makarios ever was. He is recorded saying that we should "exorcise the evil" if the Americans ever get involved in the peace process. AKEL, with its influence on the masses, are portraying the Angloamericans as our worst nightmare and the extreme right wingers also burn their antiamerican torch because the USA is a close ally to Turkey and its bombs drop in Lebanon and Afganistan rather on Ankara. Thus, again we have chosen to ignore the global interests of the people that matter in our part of the world (which we should have tried to use to our advantage) and, I am afraid, again we shall pay the bill when it eventually arrives. |
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Kifeas Warnings : 6 Ministerial

Joined: 26 Aug 2005 Posts: 2732 Location: Location: Pafos-Cyprus, since 1974 ethnic cleansing. Originally, Lapithos, northern occupied Cyprus.
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| Bananiot wrote: |
My objective ... ? Let us say I hate the hero aura we have built around Makarios. George Ball strips down Makarios of this aura and we can at last see him in the light of reality. Further and more important, it sheds light on the personality of the man but also it helps us reach the truth for a period which was and still is shrouded with mist and strong sentiments that make the seeking of truth very difficult.
However, most important, it shows how capable we are of repeating the mistakes of the past. Papadopoulos basically carries on the Makarios policies and today he is more at loggerheads with the Angloamericans than Makarios ever was. He is recorded saying that we should "exorcise the evil" if the Americans ever get involved in the peace process. AKEL, with its influence on the masses, are portraying the Angloamericans as our worst nightmare and the extreme right wingers also burn their antiamerican torch because the USA is a close ally to Turkey and its bombs drop in Lebanon and Afganistan rather on Ankara. Thus, again we have chosen to ignore the global interests of the people that matter in our part of the world (which we should have tried to use to our advantage) and, I am afraid, again we shall pay the bill when it eventually arrives. |
Bananiot, the fact that the Anglo-Americans are our worst nightmare has been proved beyond doubt in numerous occasions, and this is something even a 10 year old child can feel and understand. It was proved back in 1974. It is proved by the way they treated Turkey during the past 32 years, and finally, it is proved in the most spectacular fashion by the way in which they handled the negotiating process, forged the Annan plan and tried to push it down on us, with the sole aim to sell us out and favour their friend and ally Turkey. Unfortunatelly, they are not to be trusted, they cannot be trusted and they are not trusted! |
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erolz
Site Admin

Joined: 11 Aug 2005 Posts: 4195 Location: Kyrenia / Girne
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| Kifeas wrote: |
| Bananiot, the fact that the Anglo-Americans are our worst nightmare has been proved beyond doubt in numerous occasions, and this is something even a 10 year old child can feel and understand. It was proved back in 1974. It is proved by the way they treated Turkey during the past 32 years, and finally, it is proved in the most spectacular fashion by the way in which they handled the negotiating process, forged the Annan plan and tried to push it down on us, with the sole aim to sell us out and favour their friend and ally Turkey. Unfortunatelly, they are not to be trusted, they cannot be trusted and they are not trusted! |
These would be the same nightmare Americans that blocked Turkish intervention in 64 and again in 67, that supported the UN resolution that established the injustice of an all Greek Cypriot Republic of Cyprus adminstration being recognised as the sole legitamte government of all Cypriots (which clearly it wasnt and isnt) and still recognises it as such ?
I guess with 'enemies' like thes you don't really need friends do you ? |
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Bananiot Warnings : 1 Deputy

Joined: 13 Aug 2005 Posts: 1214 Location: Nicosia
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Well Kifeas, I answered your question very reluctantly because, as usual, you see ulterior motives behind everything. This of course clouds your mind and stops you from seeing further.
Now, if you thing that the Angloamericans are our worse nightmare, then there is no hope for us. You keep insisting that the world's only superpower is crafting our downfall and you might as well sign our death penalty.
Historically, the Americans saved our backs twice within the space of three years. In another thread you claimed that we and only we managed to prevent the invasion in both 1964 and 1967 respectively, by bluffing our way and convincing Turkey that the Turkish Cypriot population was at great risk from our guns. It is the same naivety that is exhibited all the time and this simplistic approach that everyone is against us reigns supreme still. |
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Kifeas Warnings : 6 Ministerial

Joined: 26 Aug 2005 Posts: 2732 Location: Location: Pafos-Cyprus, since 1974 ethnic cleansing. Originally, Lapithos, northern occupied Cyprus.
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| erolz wrote: |
| Kifeas wrote: |
| Bananiot, the fact that the Anglo-Americans are our worst nightmare has been proved beyond doubt in numerous occasions, and this is something even a 10 year old child can feel and understand. It was proved back in 1974. It is proved by the way they treated Turkey during the past 32 years, and finally, it is proved in the most spectacular fashion by the way in which they handled the negotiating process, forged the Annan plan and tried to push it down on us, with the sole aim to sell us out and favour their friend and ally Turkey. Unfortunatelly, they are not to be trusted, they cannot be trusted and they are not trusted! |
These would be the same nightmare Americans that blocked Turkish intervention in 64 and again in 67, that supported the UN resolution that established the injustice of an all Greek Cypriot Republic of Cyprus adminstration being recognised as the sole legitamte government of all Cypriots (which clearly it wasnt and isnt) and still recognises it as such ?
I guess with 'enemies' like thes you don't really need friends do you ? |
Yes, these are the same nightmare Anglo-Americans that were made to stop Turkey in 1964 and 1967 from completing her “noble,” “heroic” and admirable it seems to you work, that it anyway was let by them to complete in 1974, after we have been compelled to go as low (for having no other alternative to defend ourselves) as to threaten and blackmail the entire world with bluffs for massive massacres against Turkish Cypriot civilians, should Turkey proceeded further in her immoral plans to invade, ethnically cleanse and partition Cyprus. |
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Kifeas Warnings : 6 Ministerial

Joined: 26 Aug 2005 Posts: 2732 Location: Location: Pafos-Cyprus, since 1974 ethnic cleansing. Originally, Lapithos, northern occupied Cyprus.
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| Bananiot wrote: |
Well Kifeas, I answered your question very reluctantly because, as usual, you see ulterior motives behind everything. This of course clouds your mind and stops you from seeing further.
Now, if you thing that the Angloamericans are our worse nightmare, then there is no hope for us. You keep insisting that the world's only superpower is crafting our downfall and you might as well sign our death penalty.
Historically, the Americans saved our backs twice within the space of three years. In another thread you claimed that we and only we managed to prevent the invasion in both 1964 and 1967 respectively, by bluffing our way and convincing Turkey that the Turkish Cypriot population was at great risk from our guns. It is the same naivety that is exhibited all the time and this simplistic approach that everyone is against us reigns supreme still. |
Bananiot, it is one thing to be anti-Anglo-American to the extent of confronting and fighting against them by all means, and it is another thing not to trust them for their past behaviour, and to say so publicly. Cyprus is not confronting them in anyway possible, especially in relation to matters outside our direct and vital interests, but to the contrary, whatever help, service, co-operation, etc; they have asked from us, we did not refuse. And this was true during Makarios governments, and during all the subsequent ones, including the present one under Papadopoulos. We do not vertically go against them, neither we intent to do so; however we want them to know that we do not and cannot possibly trust them. |
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Bananiot Warnings : 1 Deputy

Joined: 13 Aug 2005 Posts: 1214 Location: Nicosia
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"We do not vertically go against them". What on earth does this mean? Do you think that the Americans have a second to waste with this tyranny of words?
P.S. 1. Papadopoulos seems to trust them with his health! Every now and again he jumps on the plane to get medical exams and treatment in the State.
P.S. 2. A huge American aircraft carrier docked in Limassol the other day after Christofias granted the necessary permit. About 200 tanks came off the carrier and were serviced and thoroughly washed from the desert sand, before going back to service in Iraq. This seems to me that we trust them to go about their business elsewher as long as they leave Cyprus alone. Oh, by the way, the 3000 sailors spent some serious bucks in Limassol. I heard the red light district is still partying. |
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